In this episode, I had the pleasure of hosting Ashley Grech, Chief Revenue Officer of Xero and a mother of three energetic boys. Ashley shared her journey and wisdom on balancing the demanding worlds of career and motherhood. Here's a summary of the key takeaways from our conversation that offer inspiration and practical strategies for ambitious women striving to succeed both personally and professionally.
Finding Balance
Ashley begins by acknowledging the chaos of balancing a high-powered career with the demands of motherhood. Living in San Francisco with her husband and three sons, Ashley's life is nothing short of a whirlwind. Yet, she emphasizes the importance of communication and finding balance every day with her partner.
“We're finding our balance every day. It forces my husband and me to communicate well on what's changed and what's coming.”
Support Systems Matter
Ashley shares my core belief that while it is possible for ambitious women to have it all, they certainly cannot do it all alone. She highlights the importance of building a support network. Her external support network includes a great partner, a nanny, and a thoughtful use of services like meal kits and automated grocery delivery, which help ease the burden.
“You can have it all, but you can't do it all.”
Embracing Automation
Ashley speaks at length about the importance of automating and delegating tasks to manage her household more efficiently. This ability to leverage systems and services is one of her professional superpowers applied to her personal life. By focusing on what truly matters and outsourcing the rest, she is able to better manage her time and energy.
“I started with like, I stopped making lunch… I let go of certain expectations that nobody cares about but me.”
Navigating the Professional Landscape
As a woman in a male-dominated industry, Ashley has faced her share of challenges. She recalls how, early in her career, she noticed a distinct difference between how men and women were able to balance work and family life. Despite these challenges, Ashley emphasizes the importance of being authentic and leveraging her unique strengths.
“My male peers never talked about their kids… there are lots of unconscious biases.”
Creating a Supportive Work Environment
Ashley also touches on the importance of company policies that support work-life balance. She appreciates benefits like backup childcare and eldercare services provided by previous employers, emphasizing how these can significantly aid employees.
“Companies should consider benefits that support our lives more.”
Documenting and Delegating at Work
Introducing a documentation culture in the workplace is another strategy Ashley has found effective. This culture ensures that everyone's voice is heard and valued, particularly benefiting those who might be less vocal in meetings. This equalization is particularly important for creating a more inclusive work environment.
“In a doc, anyone can comment, and it really equalizes the quietest voice and the loudest voice.”
Planning Maternity Leave
Ashley provides valuable advice for women planning their maternity leave. She suggests breaking down job responsibilities into specific tasks and assigning them to different people. Discussing and prioritizing these tasks with your boss helps ensure a smoother transition and return to work.
On the personal front, Ashley recommends planning with your partner to ensure a wonderful leave experience rather than merely surviving it. Her own experience involved defining a clear and enjoyable plan for her maternity leave, which included minimizing visitors and investing in meal services to ease daily burdens.
“Sit down with your spouse and talk about the things that you really want to be true about having a wonderful experience. Not just surviving, but best case scenario, what does a wonderful leave look like? And then from that mindset, start jotting down the things that can help make that a reality.”
Work Travel with Family
One of the most remarkable aspects of Ashley's career is her ability to bring her family along on international trips for extended periods. By challenging their own limiting beliefs and systematically addressing logistical concerns, Ashley and her husband successfully created a unique and enriching experience for their family.
“Everything is figureoutable,” Ashley confidently asserts.
Final Thoughts
Ashley Grech's story is a powerful reminder that while balancing career and motherhood is challenging, it is achievable with the right mindset and strategies. Her practical tips and experiences offer a blueprint for women seeking to navigate the complexities of modern-day life while remaining true to themselves.
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Rather read the full interview than listen?
[00:00:00] Hello, everyone on today's episode, I am welcoming one of the most impressive women. I have gotten the chance to know personally. [00:00:48] As I've shared this podcast as a response to avoid, I deeply felt in my own life looking for real life, examples of career driven, women who are also moms and making it all work. Ashley was one of the few [00:01:00] women I did have in my life that gave me confidence as I entered into this new chapter. So when I was planning the show's lineup, she was a given for me. You're going to be taking some mental notes and maybe even shocked to hear some of the tough decisions she's made to navigate her career alongside motherhood. [00:01:15] This conversation is worth Alyson. [00:01:17] Barbara: Welcome Ashley. It is so good to have you here. It's good to be here. So I have been lucky enough to know Ashley for. I think at least five years, maybe longer. We co led the San Francisco chapter of a global go to market professional community together. And anytime Ashley speaks, I feel like I walk away from the conversation smarter with a more strategic lens. [00:01:43] Barbara: So. Ashley, I am so thrilled you're here today to share some of your wisdom on navigating what we have to do to essentially cut through the chaos of motherhood and career. I think you were actually one of the first people to introduce the concept of [00:02:00] professional superpowers to me, and I know you are full of superpowers at work, and I really want to pull out how you've taken those superpowers professionally and applied them to your personal life. [00:02:11] Barbara: But before we kind of dive in, I want you to share a little bit of who you are with our listeners who don't know you. What's your elevator pitch both personally and professionally. [00:02:21] Ashley: I live in San Francisco with my husband and three sons. My kids are almost 10, 7, and 2. I'm Chief Revenue Officer at a publicly traded mid cap company that's headquartered in the Southern Hemisphere. [00:02:35] Ashley: And so that's a thing, all the travel and coordination that's required there. I've been in FinTech for 20 years now, and I just actually really enjoy taking Burden some things off of people's plates. It's who I am naturally as a person. And it's really helped me sort of pick an industry, but also get ahead in that industry too. [00:02:55] Ashley: I [00:02:55] Barbara: love that. So you are the chief revenue officer at Xero and [00:03:00] your mom to three little ones. All boys, which is just so much energy as a boy mom. I can only imagine what three of them are like at once and they're nine, seven, and two, so peak energy time. Can you set the stage for what your life looks like at the present moment? [00:03:15] Ashley: It's really messy. I'm not gonna lie. Like, it's really messy right now. They're all at different stages, right? And so, like, there's three versions of everything in the house. Clothes, shoes, books, plates. Like, small, medium, large plate. Like, it's just, it's a lot right now. But, you know what? Like, they are happy and healthy and that's all that matters. [00:03:40] Ashley: We're finding our balance every day. It like forces me and my husband to like really communicate well on like, all right, what's changed this week and next week? What's going to change in the, in the coming month? Like, how do we get in front of it? I travel a fair bit for work. I'm on a plane to the Southern hemisphere or to the [00:04:00] UK once every six weeks. [00:04:01] Ashley: Wow. And then I am typically on a plane, you know, in between that time at some point to like Denver or Toronto. So that has not been my favorite part of it. But Brian and I think a lot about what, what do we need to do to make it work? Like what are the most important things that are necessary at every point? [00:04:19] Barbara: So one of my, my core beliefs is that we as ambitious women can have it all. What having it all means that that definition I think varies on your season of life But we definitely cannot do it all so like you said you've got your partner your husband But who are some of the other people in your village that show up for you? [00:04:37] Barbara: And how do they support you through all of these travels the three sets of plates? The three different schedules, all of that. [00:04:45] Ashley: First of all, that quote is spot on. You can have it all, but you can't do it all. So if you're lucky enough to be able to have it all, it generally means that you have support. And some people are like, oh, support equals money. [00:04:59] Ashley: [00:05:00] You're like, well, not necessarily, right? Support can often mean like friends, family, or even like within yourself, like letting go of certain expectations that you had of yourself. That nobody cares about but you. So I'll share with you what my sort of like external support network looks like today. It starts with, with a great partner. [00:05:21] Ashley: Man, like, is that not the most important decision? Career decision too, right? Like, no question, my husband is the most important partner to me on so many fronts. And he supports me. In every way, we have a nanny, really, so that someone else can be the bad guy about telling the kids to pick up the socks. [00:05:41] Ashley: Somebody has to tell them to do it. Um. [00:05:43] Barbara: Outsource the nagging. [00:05:45] Ashley: Yeah. At least like half the nagging, because I consider myself to, I'm like, man, like those words are coming out of my mouth too often. But the truth is like, they've already come out of someone else's mouth and that's just what's necessary to raise young children. [00:05:58] Ashley: You know, we're really thoughtful around [00:06:00] like automating groceries. You know, we, we use like meal kits, ones that are like largely prepped, but you still have to cook them. But I read an article recently about like friendship and how critical that is to happiness in life and like making a marriage work. [00:06:16] Ashley: And so I will say I have a really good group of friends. And I don't know about you, but there's definitely a period in there where you like, you're so caught up in your own life, like your first child, your second child, you know, where your friendships perhaps take a, they become like third, fourth, fifth priority that has come back for me. [00:06:36] Ashley: And it makes a huge difference. One example is my husband went on a much deserved trip with his friends this weekend. And so I was alone with three kids and one of my girlfriends was like, I'll pick up the oldest and take him first to his. Rehearsal. Amazing. It was awesome. I didn't have to prep for lunch or anything. [00:06:56] Ashley: She just, she was like, I'll just show up. I'll pick them up. That's it. It's nice. [00:07:00] And it, and it matters like anyone who thinks that they can do it alone. They're wrong. [00:07:04] Barbara: Absolutely. And I think it's really good to hear that recognition that there is this kind of period in your life and you've experienced it as well. [00:07:12] Barbara: And I definitely did. I kind of called it like loneliness and motherhood. And it took me a while. In deep introspection to like actually understand why I was feeling lonely because I was like, I've got a lot of friends I have a lot of family, but I I was feeling this period of loneliness, but I I'm glad to hear that you also experienced that and you kind of saw your way out of it as life Progressed and you moved into a new season with slightly older kids [00:07:39] Ashley: I don't think we talk about that period enough as parents and particularly as moms And even the closest of friends will occasionally say like, I feel off and I don't know why. [00:07:50] Ashley: So anyway, I'm just putting, I'm like acknowledging that like, yeah, mine is a lot of things. It's not just about prioritization. It's also about like how you feel about, [00:08:00] I don't know, like some, something's different about how the world is colored. [00:08:03] Barbara: I totally agree. I, that resonates a lot. One of the other things you said that really resonates and kind of going back to the idea of superpowers was your term of using automation in your household and I think anybody in the work world, right? [00:08:18] Barbara: There's like two Prime topics automation and AI, right? And so talk to me a little bit more about how you've automated or delegated things within your household [00:08:29] Ashley: So for me personally, I will hold on to things until they break in my hands Like it has to break in order for me to drop the ball. And there's a blessing in that because then I know that when I let go, I'm and I've, I've already made that like conscious decision to let something go. [00:08:47] Ashley: But one of those moments was maybe when like Leo and Damien were three and one or four and two. I remember I saw this quote and it was meant to be funny, but I was like, it's like, no one appreciates [00:09:00] me staying up all night doing things that nobody asked for. And I was like, Oh. Nobody asked me to do those things. [00:09:07] Ashley: Why am I doing them? It was right around that time where it was tough for me. I had just taken on the job as the head of sales. It was a global role. I was traveling a lot. I had these two really young, beautiful children at home. We bought a house, like everything on paper was like, you should be so happy. [00:09:23] Ashley: And I wasn't. And my husband was like, our kids are not going to remember. That you made them lunch for school. They will remember if you are unhappy. Wow. I like, I, I got really emotional about it. Cause like, I don't want my children to remember me as being an unhappy parent. How terrible would that be? I was like, okay, something's got to change. [00:09:47] Ashley: So started with like, I stopped making lunch, but then that was my philosophy. I'm like, all right, what do I hate? What is also no one else care about. Things that I dislike, but other people really, really, really care about, I will keep on the table because [00:10:00] it matters to someone. So those things are cooking. [00:10:03] Ashley: My family enjoys food that I have cooked. I don't know what it is. They just love it. And so for me, it was like, okay, then I'll stop grocery shopping, essentially. Like I'm going to, I'm going to like buy these meal kits and they send you like all of the ingredients and then you assemble it and everything's delicious. [00:10:20] Ashley: I don't even really have to think about it other than to like set it four weeks in advance. I feel good about that. Other things are, you know how we sometimes joke like, Oh, wouldn't it be nice to have a wife? Like, [00:10:30] Barbara: yes. Absolutely. [00:10:32] Ashley: And. You know, buys a present and, you know, books, the playground for the next birthday party and things like that. [00:10:42] Ashley: There are a bunch of services now that if you give them access to your personal calendar, they will let you know when things are coming up and then you can assign them. And so it's like, okay, you know, Julian's birthday is coming up in a month. And then all I have to do is say like, yes. Find me a venue [00:11:00] and they'll ask, they're like, do you want a theme? [00:11:01] Ashley: I'm like, yeah. And then I'm like, no, . [00:11:06] Barbara: I can like feel the mental load like lightning just from this service, but, but okay, let's use this birthday example. I'm a very particular person. How do you let go? Like, I would easily delegate things at work because I, I trust in my team, but for personal decisions, sometimes it just feels harder. [00:11:25] Barbara: How did you come to terms with letting go of some of this stuff? [00:11:28] Ashley: Um, I did a little bit of that weighing of like, is this going to matter to them? So for example, my 10 year old's birthday It's going to be a big deal. The two year old's birthday is going to be in the park and we're going to get a bunch of pizza and some cake. [00:11:42] Ashley: And like, nobody cares, literally nobody cares. As long as there's pictures and the grandparents are there, that's all that matters. Right. So like there is a prioritization, actually even of the things that I have preferences on. Yeah. I think that comes from like, You have to drop the ball. I think it's Tiffany Dufu's book. [00:11:59] Ashley: I think it's called Drop the [00:12:00] Ball, where it's like, in order to be great at some things, you just have to let go of some of the other things. And so I think for me, it's like a constant calibration of like, okay, do I care about this on a scale of one to 10? Does anyone else care about this on a scale of one to 10? [00:12:13] Ashley: If not, then like, let's adjust our, our expectations. And we do that at work too. It's like, all right, how important is this thing for me to own myself? Versus like, okay, if someone can get it to 80%, is that okay? And then I can get it to the last 20%. And so we do it all the time at work. I just don't think we're fair to ourselves in doing it at home. [00:12:33] Ashley: And frankly, there's so many more things actually at home. [00:12:36] Barbara: Yeah. Well, like I just want to, I want to pause for a second. I just want to reiterate that it's okay to let somebody else get it to 80 percent and you finish the 20%. That is the definition of not doing it all. I love that. Okay. I love that mentality. [00:12:51] Ashley: By the way, it sounds fancy where, where I'm like, Oh, I have a virtual assistant, but it's not that fancy. It's like 40 bucks a month. [00:13:00] And I have so much lift of your mental load. That's amazing. [00:13:03] Barbara: I love this. [00:13:04] Ashley: They say like, Oh, 40 bucks a month. And there's like 15 tasks. [00:13:08] Barbara: That's, that's [00:13:09] Ashley: enough, just a little lightweight boost. [00:13:12] Ashley: That's enough. [00:13:13] Barbara: What a, what a great life hack. Thank you for sharing that. Um, I want to kind of shift gears a little bit and get into one of the reason I, I admire you so much, which is that you are, A woman and a mother in not only a male dominated role of sales and revenue, but also a male dominated industry of fintech. [00:13:37] Barbara: So, I assume that there are probably some moments you've experienced that have been really frustrating where you feel like, Potentially some of your colleagues don't truly understand kind of what's going on behind the scenes. I don't think I'll ever forget. Like I, I came back from my second maternity leave and my VP of sales was like, Oh, I didn't know if you were going to come back. [00:13:57] Barbara: And I can imagine that that is [00:14:00] probably a more common attitude than not in certain fields and industries. And so can you kind of. Talk to me a little bit about what your experience has been like working in this industry as a woman and a parent. [00:14:12] Ashley: Sure. I'll start with finance. And I will say, you know, I was with JPMorgan for 13 years and they were very much on the earlier end of the diversity and inclusion in the workplace, particularly around female representation. [00:14:26] Ashley: And even then, most of the people that were in leadership roles had a stay at home spouse. Very few of them were women. In the one or two that you could count in the senior most levels on one hand, they typically had a stay at home partner. And so it was like, I don't have that. Like, how are we going to do that? [00:14:43] Ashley: And you know, my male peers never talked about their kids. So it's almost as if they didn't exist. They didn't really talk about their spouse. There certainly didn't seem to be any like responsibility. It sounds unfair when I say it, but like it was how I felt at the time. I was like, how can you go to [00:15:00] happy hour all the time? [00:15:01] Ashley: Or how come like you get to go golfing on the weekends? Like who, who's taking care of your children? And I remember, you know, at one point, one of my male colleagues was like, I'm going to run a triathlon. I'm like, Who's looking after your kids? I'm like, with what time, right? So I will say it was never pernicious, but there, there's lots of unconscious bias. [00:15:24] Ashley: Like similar to you, I came back from my second mat leave and my systems were not active. And it's like, nobody really thought that Anything of it. They were like, oh, well, I'm like, they knew my return date and yet I was without systems like, no Salesforce, nothing for a solid two weeks. What a waste of your time. [00:15:44] Ashley: What [00:15:44] Barbara: a waste of your time. And theirs . [00:15:46] Ashley: And I was like, I, and then someone asked me how my vacation was . I would be infuriated. I know, I was like, well, you know, not washing your hair regularly is not a [00:16:00] vacation. But, thank you for asking. So anyway, it was, it was difficult. But I would actually say it, it perhaps overcorrected in a way that I could no longer be them. [00:16:11] Ashley: Right? Like the best you can hope for if you're sort of imitating someone that you're not is to be a watered down, less successful version of them. So the only way out of that was how do I just be myself? How do I bring the things that I know I'm great at to the forefront and just be really good? Which hopefully will outweigh the difference, like the, the non sameness. [00:16:35] Ashley: Right? Right. And that worked for me. And I did vow at that point to not hide my differences. Like, I still sometimes, even today, hesitate in saying, I can't do that because I have to pick up the kids. But that's changing year over year. Like I will say with more certainty, like it's my responsibility. I'm going to do that. [00:16:59] Ashley: Or I [00:17:00] will be offline at six. But I think the best thing you can be is yourself. Everything, everyone else has taken like whatever that code is, like everyone else has taken. Um, show up [00:17:09] Barbara: authentically. Yeah. It's like what we were talking about. That is [00:17:11] Ashley: the tremendous uplift for me. [00:17:13] Barbara: So, after everything you've experienced, how do you think about, as a leader, what you can do to really shift and change company culture? [00:17:23] Ashley: I think it starts with transparency, right? Sharing that, how we do things. Like everyone's hoping for the book, like someone just tell me what to do. So I think the more we can be transparent around like how we're making it all work, I think that's really important. The second, and this is actually more of like an HR note, is that I do think that companies should consider benefits that support our lives more. [00:17:49] Ashley: For example, a company that I work for, we got a care. com benefit where we would get Backup days. And it was backup days for pet care, elder care, and [00:18:00] childcare. And it's like, that is how you do your job. If you sort of squint around that, the other element of that is like, I can do my job well, if my home is cared for. [00:18:14] Barbara: So true. My husband had that same benefit at his last company. And when he left that job, I was. So sad to lose that because yeah, we, we had 10 days of backup and you never know, like schools are closed a lot. There's a lot of vacation days, you know, in school and it's, it comes in handy. [00:18:29] Ashley: One, one last thing about creating a more accepting workplace is. [00:18:35] Ashley: Perhaps more surprising and less talked about. It's the prevalence of documentation culture as opposed to meeting culture. So I don't disagree. Collaboration is really important and it's what greases the wheels. No question. But I really appreciated being immersed in a doc culture because one, it forced you to write out your thoughts and it really forces very crisp [00:19:00] articulation. [00:19:01] Ashley: of an argument. But what it also did, some like ancillary side effects, is it allows people to comment with equal voice. So in a meeting, usually only the boldest, most outgoing person will command the room with their arguments, with their feedback, with ideas. But in a dock, anyone can comment and it really equalizes the quietest voice and the loudest voice. [00:19:26] Ashley: And that is a huge difference maker, especially for women in this. I saw it with my own eyes and I'm never going back. Like it's really important to me that people have an equal voice. And I think doc culture really helps. [00:19:38] Barbara: That makes so much sense. And I've never thought about that in a job search perspective of things to look for in a company. [00:19:47] Barbara: And I love that. I want to, I want to jump back to something earlier. You also said around your maternity leave. So I think there's so much fear and anxiety around what going on maternity leave will do to our [00:20:00] careers. And so I'm curious, like, You went back to work and all of your systems were turned off. [00:20:06] Barbara: Like, how did that make you feel? Like, obviously that surprised you. Were there other things that surprised you? [00:20:15] Ashley: It did surprise me. I was disappointed. I was really disappointed because I wanted to feel like when I was leaving home, I was walking into a place that was really excited to receive me, right? [00:20:29] Ashley: Like it, then it's, it's, I hesitate to use the word worth it, but like, then it makes it okay. That like you're needed, you're wanted there when you return. And so I would say like, as companies think about a return to work processes, they would do well to remember what someone is leaving behind and to really welcome them back. [00:20:52] Barbara: Yeah. [00:20:52] Ashley: It's nice to feel needed at work. Otherwise I wouldn't have chosen to go back. Right. Like, yes, we need the money too. Right. But [00:21:00] there is an element of like, how do you, how do you step back into the workplace? And how are you welcomed and received? And so I think about that a lot. [00:21:08] Barbara: Looking back at your Previous experiences like if you're going to create your own maternity leave playbook, right to own That process both leaving and returning. [00:21:20] Barbara: What would you advise our listeners to build? [00:21:23] Ashley: One thing is to take your own job and break it out into all the jobs to be done. So we often think of our jobs as like a monolithic thing. But if you were to like break it down into a job description, for example, like what are the components of the job description? [00:21:36] Ashley: And then think about who you can assign those respective components to. One, because it's not fair to assign everything to someone else. It's impossible. But the other is like that they won't all get done if they are sort of wholesale placed somewhere. And so how do you think about dividing it and then discuss that the jobs to be done with you? [00:21:53] Ashley: I always think of Actually thinking about when we hire someone too, because my team will come to be like, we need to hire for this role, like [00:22:00] for whatever role, like, is that a full job or are those like jobs to be done? And where can we put them? Can we outsource them? We get a contractor to do these, these like focused, specific jobs. [00:22:10] Ashley: And so the same rules apply when you think about your own matinee. How do you break it down and where do they go? And if you're at a company, lucky enough where there's like true backup, Then that's great. If not, then have a conversation with your boss about it. And then also force a conversation about prioritization. [00:22:26] Ashley: It's like, all right, if we can't do all of these things in my absence, like what are the most important things to do? And having an opinion on it first really, really matters. Then on the personal side, I would say sit down with your spouse and talk about the things that you really want to be true about having like a wonderful experience. [00:22:47] Ashley: Not just like, surviving. Cause I think we all joke about it, it's like sort of a cultural trope to joke about survival at that time. But like, best case scenario, what does a wonderful leave look like? And then from that [00:23:00] mindset, start jotting down the things that can help make that a reality. Look, when we had Julian, who's our third, that like, broke the mold. [00:23:08] Ashley: Like, I, I will fully admit, like, for us we were like, I'm not sure how we're gonna do this. It was the ultimate reflex of like, I just can't. I can't. Why? I was working harder than I had ever been working, ever. I had this big job at Square, big global role, and I just didn't know how I was gonna do it. Like, I couldn't in my brain, like, reorganize all the pieces, and that is my superpower. [00:23:36] Ashley: And I knew at that moment, like, because I couldn't access my innate problem solving ability around it, I was like, something's not working. At that point, when I found out I was pregnant with my third, I muscled through it for another like 10 weeks or so, but, and ultimately I went. But honestly, like, what a wonderful decision. [00:23:56] Ashley: Cause it, it gave me the space to really think about like, what do I want [00:24:00] a leave period. To look like my husband and I were like, okay, we want to love this time. The first two times we were just trying to make it, how do we make it so that we love the first 12 weeks, let's say of, of your third child and likely your last. [00:24:17] Ashley: And so we, we really like got down to brass tacks and it was like, what's it going to take? It means that, you know, we minimize visitors for the first four weeks. Let's like actually order a meal service. They're terribly expensive. I'm not going to lie. It was, it was like, but we saw it as like a finite time. [00:24:35] Ashley: I was like, okay, for two months, we're just like, we're just gonna, we're not going to cook at all. We're going to like enjoy baby bath time. I'm going to show, I'm going to shower. I'm going to go on walks. All the things that you like, you try to add up and then the numbers don't, they don't stack. You're like, I have to do laundry, I have to nap, I have to wash my hair, I have to cook, I have to feed the baby. [00:24:59] Ashley: [00:25:00] And then the only thing that actually happens is you wind up feeding the baby. [00:25:04] Barbara: Oh yeah, praying that somebody around you is going to notice that you literally cannot put another dish in the sink because there is no room. [00:25:11] Ashley: Exactly. So I think it was like, we really prioritized the things that we wanted to take off our plates so that we could fill our cups with them. [00:25:20] Barbara: I love that. And I love that you took your first two experiences right as the catalyst to be like, we're going to make this different. And we know. Where we cannot own those tasks. We know the bandwidth at this point and like those investments make a huge difference. Hopefully that you were able to like enjoy that period more than you were for the, for your previous, not to mention you also had your kids, right? [00:25:45] Barbara: Thought you had to, to think about and still manage that household component. [00:25:49] Ashley: That's a good call though. In that I also didn't want to be some like exhausted rage monster. [00:25:56] Barbara: Yeah [00:25:57] Ashley: with my other beautiful kids that [00:26:00] can remember now, right? Like I just I didn't want that experience and and you know what like it turned out really well It was the best year on record [00:26:09] Barbara: Okay, we I need to go deeper into this Around the fact that you left your job while pregnant and just a pause here I remember we were at a dinner and I was pregnant my second was born maybe just even a couple weeks after after your third and You So you're a month ahead of me, you're showing more, and you're like, I'm pregnant and I'm leaving my job. [00:26:30] Barbara: Like, you told me both of those things at once, and I was like, what? You are making the conscious decision to leave your job while pregnant? It's usually the opposite, right? You're like, I'm definitely not leaving my job when I'm pregnant. And so, Talk to me about that decision. Like, how did you come to that decision and, and come to terms with the fact that like, you wouldn't get that coveted maternity leave that people are normally like sticking it out for? [00:26:57] Ashley: I think even the way you said it [00:27:00] reflected how I felt in the past two times where I was like, I just need to get through this. And I thought, man, what a way to live, where we're constantly just trying to get through our biggest milestones. Our most beautiful, enriching, important legacies, and I'm just trying to get through it. [00:27:19] Ashley: I think there was an unconscious element where I, I remember finding out that I was pregnant and being simultaneously like happy and also just flat out like terrified. I was like, how am I going to do this? I already am in the biggest job I've ever been in, right? With the biggest team I've ever managed. [00:27:38] Ashley: And the most responsibility overall. And so I just, it was one of those moments where I was like, I can't even imagine coming back from leave into the same job. And then I gave it a week and I was like, I think something's wrong in that statement. Actually, if I can't imagine coming back into this job at all, again, like I couldn't access my own [00:28:00] superpowers. [00:28:01] Ashley: Like I have very high tolerance for chaos. And I'm really good at taking things that are hard and figuring them out. And because I couldn't, I was like, I don't think this is the job. [00:28:12] Barbara: That must have taken so much. I feel like given the job you were in and how chaotic it was, your life is a lot. Like, I just feel like that must have been the hardest decision. [00:28:24] Ashley: It was, it was hard, but I think, you know, one thing that I would tell anyone is that anything is figureoutable. And so maybe our greatest gift to ourselves is to like drop the expectations of what we should be doing. I should go on this leave. I should return. Right. But we often think like what's in front of us and then there's the unknown and we don't explore the unknown. [00:28:48] Ashley: But if, if within the unknown, we know that everything's gonna be fine, then we'll get there. I realize now it's not about like, Oh, do you regret it or not? It's more like I recognize something in myself where at the [00:29:00] time I was exhausted and I, I have vowed like not to allow myself to get to that same point where I am incapable of making good decisions. [00:29:09] Ashley: Good. That's great. I think also as parents, we feel from time to time, I recognize it occasionally in friends when they're like, I don't feel happy. Or disappointed. I just don't feel anything. I'm like just trying to get through it and you're like, okay There are times like that, but like let's not make that the normal [00:29:26] Barbara: I resonate with that so much because I feel like the last few months I was in my last job That's how I felt and it took me a while to feel confident and comfortable even saying that out loud and so i'm curious for you like obviously you and your partner have Such a good communication, but like, how did that conversation go? [00:29:45] Barbara: Were you like, I'm going to take this amount of time off. How did you set it up for that financially? Like, how did you work with your partner on this? [00:29:51] Ashley: Oh, he has always been super supportive. We're not big spenders to begin with, to be honest. And we always joke that the greatest success in [00:30:00] life is to not spend so that you can have, you What he calls FU money, which is like, if you don't want to be at this job, you can like throw the cards on the table and be like, I'm out. [00:30:10] Ashley: And we always joked about it, but this was the only time it's ever actually. You had [00:30:14] Barbara: it [00:30:15] Ashley: like, all right, well, can we do this? So sure we can do it. Like it'll be fine. So we had ample savings. He was working at the time in a job that was fine. Like it wouldn't cover everything, including the mortgage, but it would, it would cover most. [00:30:30] Ashley: And so everything else we'll just figure it out. And. We sort of gave ourselves like six to eight months And I knew that if the six to eight months was was good mental Milestoning to figure out like, okay, that sounds like a reasonable time. And then we cut down our nanny's hours as well. So there were some trade offs in the mix, but I think the, the key point to point out was like, we were ready for it before it happened. [00:30:54] Barbara: Yeah. I love that. So fast forward, you kind of went on this pause, you enjoyed your [00:31:00] maternity leave and you ended up landing in your current role after some time. Um, I'm so curious, and I was really excited to talk to you about this today. You talk about going to Australia, New Zealand. You have actually like brought your entire family with you for like long periods of time. [00:31:19] Barbara: And I would love to know more about this. Like how are you doing that? Your husband's coming. All three of your kids have come with you. Like, how are you doing that? Tell me how you're doing this, because I think a lot of people would love to find a role that like required them to travel, but then bring their family along with them. [00:31:40] Ashley: You know, like so many things the first time you hear it, you're like, that's crazy. And then you give it a week and you're like, well, you know, maybe it's not so crazy. And then honestly, like, you know, three weeks later, we're like, okay, we can do it. Like, so I think the first, the first step is. Genuinely asking yourself, like, is it crazy? [00:31:59] Ashley: Like, has [00:32:00] anyone ever done this before? Like, is that even possible? And then, then ask yourself, why do I believe that? Why do I believe it's crazy? Because the kids are in school, because my husband's working, because we need childcare. Well, like, where would we even live? We can't live in a hotel room. And then you break down each and every one of those. [00:32:18] Ashley: You're like, all right, we don't have to live in a hotel room. We're going to Airbnb. And it's going to be the same cost as the company's per diem on hotels. No problem. Actually, check, right? Get yourself an Airbnb outside of central, downtown, whatever, right? Get it in a suburb, and I guarantee you it's the same, it's the same price as a per diem, right? [00:32:37] Ashley: And then it's like, okay, the kids are in school. So can I take them out of school? What would that entail? So we like, we, you know, over the course of a few weeks, my husband and I, like, we went to the school. We asked them like, what would that require? What does home study look like? And then we were like, all right, it's a lot, it's still a lot. [00:32:54] Ashley: So what if we just did it essentially between Thanksgiving and Christmas? So they only miss four weeks of [00:33:00] school and then they get Thanksgiving off. Right. And then we can roll it into the Christmas holidays. And then it was like, okay, what do we do about the nanny? We asked the nanny, do you want to come? [00:33:11] Ashley: And she was like, yes. So she did come with us, but we also, my big kids, a Chinese tutor, Chinese tutor came three times a week. Like, so it, we like, we made it work and then we legitimately lived there. Like we lived in a neighborhood where we got to know the playground. We went to the supermarket every week. [00:33:29] Ashley: Like. It was fun. And so I would say like, everything is figureoutable. The most important thing though is to like, break down the limiting beliefs in there. Like, why do I think that this is impossible? [00:33:40] Barbara: Yes. I think a lot of people, this is gonna spark like, okay, maybe I, maybe I can do this because I think a lot of us, right, have kind of like this wonderlust. [00:33:48] Barbara: We want to travel still with our kids. But like we're balancing work, right? Just can't take a month off that easily and figuring out some ways potentially to like layer on a work trip, to like [00:34:00] extend it, work somewhere else, if you work remote, like these things are possible. So I hope, I hope you've inspired a few people listening that [00:34:08] Ashley: you can do this. [00:34:09] Ashley: Next up, we'll probably do it over the summer so that we don't have to like worry with the homeschool, but you can find, you know, a babysitter or a nanny. In another country for a month or two or even just a few weeks like all of that is possible [00:34:23] Barbara: It really is looking back. Is there like a mantra or an affirmation or a one liner you would tell yourself on your Hardest of days where it felt like work motherhood Self identity were we're all colliding at once [00:34:38] Ashley: the thing I tell myself on days like that is You can do hard things you have already done hard things That's it. [00:34:46] Ashley: Simple, [00:34:47] Barbara: but so [00:34:47] Ashley: effective. It's always been true. It's always been true. And every, as I said, like, everything is figureoutable. [00:34:53] Barbara: I love it. Thank you for inspiring me, and I'm sure so many of our listeners today, Ashley. What's the [00:35:00] best way for our audience to connect with you after this episode? [00:35:03] Ashley: You can find me on LinkedIn, and I look forward to keep chatting about this over time. [00:35:07] Barbara: Ashley, thank you so much for being here. I think everybody is walking away with that more strategic version of themselves like I promised they would in the beginning of this episode. Thank you so much. Thank you. Have a great day. [00:35:21] Barbara : Thanks for listening to this episode of the new modern mom podcast. I hope you can use the story shared today to simplify the chaos of career and motherhood. If you like what you heard, don't forget to subscribe to this podcast. Give us a five star rating and leave a review. Please connect with me on LinkedIn and follow new modern mom on Instagram. [00:35:40] Barbara : I know you're busy and I so appreciate your support for my mission to help more moms find work life fulfillment. And I have good news. The playbook doesn't end here. To get bonus strategies, tools, and takeaways from this guest, sign up for my newsletter at NewModernMom. com backslash subscribe. I [00:36:00] promise you'll be filing this under a must read.Author
