Want to help your kids build healthy tech habits right from the start? Tune in to today’s episode of The New Modern Mom Podcast to hear from Nicky Jackson Colaco, the VP of Public Policy at Roblox. Nicky’s got over 20 years of experience at tech giants like Instagram and Facebook and knows all about balancing life as a mom to two boys.
In this chat, we dive into real-life tips on managing screen time, teaching kids about media, and keeping them safe online. Plus, Nicky shares her take on co-parenting with her ex and how to take smart career risks as you navigate the different seasons of motherhood. You’ll walk away with tons of practical advice to use at home and work!
📱 Managing Technology and Screen Time
Managing screen time can be challenging, but Nicky offers practical advice on how to introduce it without it taking over. She emphasizes the importance of teaching kids about what they're watching and understanding the intention behind it.
“It's really important that kids understand what an ad is or what a commercial really is. And then what are the different parts of YouTube and what parts do we as a family think are okay and which parts are we just not going to engage in?”
🔐 Digital Privacy for Children
In today’s digital age, teaching kids about privacy is more important than ever. Nicky shares insights on how to help children navigate online spaces safely, whether they’re gaming or chatting.
“The conversation isn't just about privacy. It's about kind of broader media literacy. So when my kids were really young, I'm a huge reader. Like I love to read. That's kind of my escape. It's like my gym or my church that's where I go when I want to relax.”
⚖️ Work-Life Juggle
Finding a balance between work and life can be tough, but Nicky discusses strategies to make it more manageable. She talks about how every mom feels busy and shares tips to help juggle everything without losing your mind.
“I feel busy, and I feel constantly like I'm about to drop something… Balance is just something we all strive for, and I don't see very many people achieving it.”
🧒 Parenting and Co-Parenting Dynamics
Parenting, especially in a co-parenting setup, requires clear communication and division of duties. Nicky explains how she manages co-parenting responsibilities and keeps things running smoothly.
“I co-parent with the boy's dad, who is a great dad, and we have a great relationship… In our house, she said, ‘I think it's good not to have technology in bedrooms.'”
🎯 Risk-Taking in Career
Taking risks can lead to significant career advancements. Nicky shares her experiences with risk-taking and encourages others to seize growth opportunities.
“Don't not raise your hand for things because you're a mom because it's really important to just, I think, not have those regrets. If there's something that you absolutely know that you can't do because it directly comes out of your family time…don't have guilt or shame.”
🗓️ Building Support Systems
A strong support system is essential for balancing career and family. Nicky discusses how to set one up using family, a great nanny, and tech tools like shared calendars.
“We hired a nanny when I was going back to work with my first son, and we were super grateful for her…I always say to any mom, whatever form the help comes in, get help for yourself.”\
🌟 Personal Growth and Management
Feeling valued and heard is crucial, whether you’re at home or work. Nicky talks about the importance of recognizing the people in your life and fostering growth.
“I try to really see those things about people and acknowledge them, try to give them a platform. I feel really strongly about helping people grow because I've had really great people in my life who've helped me grow.”
📚 Love for Reading
Reading can be a fantastic escape, and Nicky shares her passion for it. She explains why reading just for fun is totally worth it.
“I just like to read for pure escapism. Even if it's nonfiction, it could be about something super, I don't know, not very relaxing, but it's still an escape for me…I love my job and I love where I live, but I want to read about something totally different.”
Whether you’re trying to keep your kids safe online, juggle work and home life, or just sneak in some time for a good book, this episode’s got the tips and tricks to help you out!
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[00:00:00] Barbara Mighdoll: You know, the dream of having it all a thriving career, an active social life, present time with your kids in adventures and travel, but how the F can we actually do it all? Welcome to the new modern mom podcast. I'm your host, Barbara Migdal, a former tech exec turned entrepreneur and mother of two. My superpower is creating order out of chaos, and I want to help ambitious moms feel enabled to do the same. [00:00:27] Barbara Mighdoll: In each episode, I'm interviewing VPs, C level executives, and founders to learn the real proven strategies they use to find work life fulfillment. Together, we're building the playbook for the new modern mom. [00:00:42] Barbara Mighdoll: Hello everyone today. My guest is Nikki Jackson. Coloso who was a mom to two. And who has over 20 years of experience in public policy. Currently the VP of global public affairs at roadblocks, a massive kids gaming platform. And previously she held roles at Instagram [00:01:00] and managed safety and privacy for children at Facebook. [00:01:02] Barbara Mighdoll: I wanted Nikki to join me for a chat, a little different than previous episodes, given her background and the ages of her children. [00:01:09] Barbara Mighdoll: She's got some amazing insights into practical strategies for managing technology and screen time and teaching your kids about privacy at a young age. Not only that, but she has an amazing perspective on risk-taking in your career map to the different stages of parenting. I know you're going to walk away with some tangible tips that you'll want to implement in your household. [00:01:30] Barbara Mighdoll: Let's get to it. [00:01:33] Barbara Mighdoll: Welcome Nikki. I'm so excited to have you here today. Thanks so much for having me. So today we are going to be talking about what we have to do in order to effectively cut through the chaos of balancing motherhood and career. You are an absolute powerhouse and I want to know how you've taken your professional superpowers and applied them to your personal life. [00:01:53] Barbara Mighdoll: So let's get started. Can you begin with a short elevator pitch on who you are personally [00:02:00] and professionally? Yeah. First and foremost, I have two boys who are not quite teenager and a teenager. So 12 and 14. And in my professional life, I work at Roblox. I lead government relations. So I'm the vice president of public policy. [00:02:18] Nicky Jackson: And I always think it's so funny that we're always talking about balance because. Balance is just something we all strive for and I don't see very many people achieving it. So, but I do have those two parts of my life and yeah, it's a constant work in progress. Absolutely. Can you set the stage for what life looks like at the present moment? [00:02:39] Nicky Jackson: Yeah, I, well, first I should share that I am divorced and I co parent with the boy's dad, who is a great dad and we have a great relationship. So I'm lucky. In that sense, because not everyone is able to. Have that kind of dynamic if they're divorced or separated or whatever your personal situation is. And [00:03:00] it's funny when you think about motherhood, every stage is great and every stage is so hard. [00:03:06] Nicky Jackson: So when they're little, I think it's a lot of physical. Exhaustion, not getting sleep, worried about, are they doing this? Are they doing that? Are they hitting their milestones? And then as they get older, where mine are now 12 and 14 and I have boys. So without generalizing too much, they are constantly full of energy. [00:03:24] Nicky Jackson: There's a lot of negotiation going in the house, or they think there's a lot of negotiation going on in the house. And it becomes, I think, more physical where it's just. Oh my gosh, if I have to drive to one more soccer game this weekend, even though I love that my son plays soccer and I love the joy he gets from it, but I just get me out of this car. [00:03:42] Nicky Jackson: I can't handle it. And also the mental piece of it picks up quite a bit. So really wanting to get answers right for them about how they are negotiating friendships. Some of the questions they're asking about at a really basic level, like ethics and morals and all of that kind of stuff. I [00:04:00] think the mental game takes over. [00:04:02] Nicky Jackson: As they get a little bit older. So I constantly feel like I'm trying to keep up with them. And then at work, I work for a technology company and my job is global, which means that. I'm talking to my teams in Europe when I get up in the morning and then my team in Asia when I'm going to bed at night and trying to make sure that my team is happy and fulfilled and you want to get the work piece of your life right as well. [00:04:32] Nicky Jackson: So every mom I know, whatever their situation is, I feel busy and I feel constantly like I'm about to drop something. Well, because you're constantly always on, it sounds like. Given that your roles have been so formative for social media policy and privacy for children, I feel like we must start the conversation here. [00:04:52] Barbara Mighdoll: I know that your kids are social media age, and I know my friends, many of us have kids under the age of five. We have a [00:05:00] lot of conversations about raising our kids in what feels like such a tricky and exposed environment. To level set, how do we start talking about privacy with our kids? It's, it's really hard. [00:05:12] Nicky Jackson: And to your point, kids start using something like YouTube. YouTube is social media. There's commenting going on. It's very social. They have creators and influencers there. And kids who are young start becoming aware of that kind of content. To me, the conversation isn't just about privacy. It's about Kind of broader media literacy. [00:05:34] Nicky Jackson: So when my kids were really young, I'm a huge reader. Like I love to read. That's kind of my escape. It's like my gym or my church, that's where I go and I want to relax. And so getting them to read and really putting an emphasis on books, graphic novels, audio books, whatever form it was really important for me. [00:05:52] Nicky Jackson: Then when they started, if we were ever on an airplane, I think if you're a mom who's ever traveled with a child, you're just so thankful if there's some screen there, [00:06:00] because there's a limit to what we can entertain them with. For hours. That's when they started using screens more and becoming more aware. [00:06:06] Nicky Jackson: And it is, they just, I'm not gonna use the word addictive, but they just, it's so attractive to them to be on these screens. And the conversation for me and my kids started with like, when we would watch a cartoon. And this was when they were young, not super young. I was like, Hey, do you know that's an ad? [00:06:23] Nicky Jackson: Like that thing that comes after the content, that's actually an advertisement. I know it looks super cool to you, but you know, that's somebody selling you something and it's really abstract and kids are like, whatever. I just want to keep watching Bluey. But. I think you can start sort of shaping what they understand to be true about media and also like commenting on videos or whatever they might think that's really cool. [00:06:47] Nicky Jackson: Well that could be public on the internet or even if that's for your friends that's you're now in like a social setting. So I think it starts with just basic literacy and then as they get older you can talk more about privacy [00:07:00] and reputation sharing. In more like technical detail, but I think it's really important that kids understand what an ad is or what a commercial really is. [00:07:11] Nicky Jackson: And then what are the different parts of YouTube and what parts do we as a family think are okay and which parts are we just not going to engage in? Absolutely. And yeah, I think with my first, we really held out on screen time until we took our first flight when he was around 14 months old, but then my second, she's around my son. [00:07:32] Barbara Mighdoll: And so she's started asking for an iPad way sooner. And so when you think about introducing screen time, what are some of those things you should look out for when it comes to selecting the apps that, that you're choosing or even like the device itself? Yeah, I think that so every family is different. [00:07:51] Nicky Jackson: Every child is different. It's really hard to, to speak generally about this because everyone's philosophy is a little different and I'm a pretty no judgment kind of [00:08:00] person. And I think Moms and families are in a good position to know what their kids need. But as a general rule, I feel like it's really difficult for parents, me included, to be able to understand the settings of every single app they're using. [00:08:17] Nicky Jackson: So we started really small, like one or two things. And it really was about shows that we would download. So it was content that we kind of controlled and downloaded to their iPad. We talked a lot about moderation. I feel this way about food. I feel this way about media. Nothing is inherently bad or good. [00:08:36] Nicky Jackson: You never want kids to feel, or at least I don't want my kids to feel, shame for wanting to watch TV, but nor are we going to watch it all day, every day. It's like moderation and balance. So. We're gonna watch one episode or you get two episodes or whatever that number is for you And then we're gonna go outside and play or fresh air or books or whatever we're gonna do after that But I [00:09:00] think the conversation about moderation is really key like balance And not making them feel like anything really terrible or really great or, Oh, you have to eat your peas now. [00:09:09] Nicky Jackson: And that equals reading. It's like, no, reading is super, we want it to be fun and not like a punishment or something. Everything is good, but we just choose when we do that kind of stuff. And then I, this is personal, it's just for me. And it's funny because I've worked in social media and I know this world really well. [00:09:24] Nicky Jackson: I do have a 12 year old and a 14 year old. We just have gotten them super basic phones, not smartphones. They're the ones that. You can text and you can call and I don't see that changing honestly for the foreseeable future probably until high school again. This is my personal decision and they don't have social media and we'll probably hold off there as long as we can again. [00:09:47] Nicky Jackson: Not because I think it's inherently terrible or. Or great. But just because I think that's the right decision for my two. But I will also say just my, I have one son when he was really little, he was having some expressive and [00:10:00] receptive language issues watching TV for him was like, he could get more language and connect with characters. [00:10:06] Nicky Jackson: I'm not saying this was like a therapy, but we really saw that it helped him. Process language and learn new words in a way that we weren't able to teach him every day. So everybody's situation is different. And so people are going to use technology tools in different ways. And I just don't think any of us should be playing the shame game. [00:10:23] Nicky Jackson: But again, if you want to set limits and you want to say, Hey, like it's time to go outside. Yeah. I think moderation is really key. I mean, I think moderation in general is just outside of screen time or anything. Like you said, it's such a valuable life lesson. You can't just be all in on one thing all the time. [00:10:38] Barbara Mighdoll: So I love that. And I like that term. I haven't introduced that with my son yet, but I think that's something I'm definitely going to start doing. You know, you mentioned downloading shows as a strategy to kind of really control it. what your children are being exposed to. But I'm curious on the games front, um, because that's [00:11:00] something that like we as parents may not be as exposed to. [00:11:03] Barbara Mighdoll: Oh, Bluey is great, right? We can watch Bluey, but how do you kind of vet the games that your children are being exposed to, or that you download for them? Yeah, and to your point, like apps and games is kind of a whole new world because you're exponentially increasing the amount of content that they have access to. [00:11:22] Nicky Jackson: So I think almost every app or game in an app store has an age rating or some kind of rating that The publisher, which is like the term people are making that game, think it's appropriate for and it's usually in line with kind of industry standards. So similar to when you take your kids to a movie and it's PG or G, you can find out the rating. [00:11:43] Nicky Jackson: I also think there are great websites. So common sense media. It rates almost every game, it rates books, movies, TV shows, and I find that to be a really useful website just for our own family use to understand like, is this movie okay for us to [00:12:00] watch all together? Is it not? And I'm still using that now because there's difference between what a 14 year old's ready to watch and what like a 17 year old is ready to watch, at least in my family. [00:12:10] Nicky Jackson: So I do think there are, um, tips and tricks, but if all else fails, like when I think about it, Games and gaming. I think the part of it comes back to your family. Are you okay with, like, shooting in a game? Are you not? Do the games have that? Do they not? Are they really kind of basic adopt me or where it's like more pets and things like that? [00:12:30] Nicky Jackson: What is the kind of content of the game? I do, even feeling spread really thin, I do try to understand what is in a game. And for example, I don't think Fortnite is bad, but we waited for Fortnite because it's like an older kid kind of game. So in our house, we waited for Fortnite until honestly six months ago. [00:12:48] Nicky Jackson: I think part of it comes back to your values. We have a deal with our kids that they have to ask before they download an app. There are ways to control this, but they have to ask to download an app. They have to ask if [00:13:00] they wanna watch even a YouTube video. I know this probably sounds really strict, and our deal on our side is that we will 99% of the time say, yep, absolutely go for it. [00:13:10] Nicky Jackson: Like moderation. Yep. You can watch or you can watch a half hour of soccer plays on YouTube, but you have to ask me and I have to say, okay. And they know that it's a way of promoting trust. It really isn't about the content at that point. It's about we're asking you to do something. And, and you're giving us permission, so we have that line of communication open. [00:13:29] Nicky Jackson: And I think as a parent, if you can say yes a bunch, it encourages them to keep asking because they know that communication stays open. I think it comes back to the tools that are available, ratings, some websites, and then really just thinking about what's right for your family. And if you can, if you have the time, taking a look at their iPad and just making sure that there aren't apps or games that you're not familiar with. [00:13:50] Nicky Jackson: And if there are, had they get there, do you want to have that conversation and then what's in them and are you okay with that? Yeah. And you mentioned that your [00:14:00] children, from a cell phone perspective, you've kind of limited the type of phone. That they are having, and I'm sure there's like a host of reasons, right? [00:14:07] Barbara Mighdoll: Like not having instant access to the internet, like so many reasons that makes sense, but kind of going back to the idea of privacy being a component of that, at what age do you feel like it's the right time to really start talking about privacy and like empowering them to start making certain types of decisions around. [00:14:26] Barbara Mighdoll: Their own privacy or where they appear, I feel like it starts really early. And if you think about it, even outside of the technology space, a lot of parents are having conversations with their kids about like your body is something that is appropriate for Your mom to see or your dad to see and the doctor. [00:14:46] Nicky Jackson: And that's really it. Like if anyone's asking to look at your body and I'm kind of oversimplifying, but those conversations about privacy start really early. I think kids have to be old enough to understand a bit about how the internet [00:15:00] works. I think one of the ways we started talking about this was around commenting and chatting, right? [00:15:06] Nicky Jackson: Because you can be playing a game in a Like Roblox, for example, and other kids can chat and send messages. Or you can be, you know, looking at a YouTube video and people are commenting and we started to introduce. That's a public space. So you're no longer just. With your friend John or your friend Ava, now you are in a different space. [00:15:31] Nicky Jackson: Those are people that you might not know. And I don't think it's about scaring kids, but it is about, you actually don't know who that is. And even somebody that says that they're Timmy, who's 13 or 14 or whatever it is, you actually don't know that. And so a rule that we have is. We don't let them chat or they can play like, for example, Roblox and watch the chat and stuff like that, but we don't really want them like engaging [00:16:00] and we don't want them doing one on one chat and we talk a lot about public spaces versus private spaces. [00:16:06] Nicky Jackson: My kids aren't at the age quite yet where we're talking about reputation and something that you post can last in perpetuity. But we do talk a lot about. What's appropriate in terms of chatting and strangers. And even for people, they know if something makes you feel uncomfortable, like how can you talk to us? [00:16:23] Nicky Jackson: That kind of thing. The other rule that we have, which may sound like a violation of their privacy, but it's something that a very wise friend who's a child psychologist told me. And again, everything it's per family. So whatever works for you, but been in our house, she said, I think it's good not to have technology in bedrooms. [00:16:42] Nicky Jackson: And I was like, well, what do you mean by that? Because my kids have an echo or like the little Alexa in their bedroom so they can listen to music. And it again depends on the family, but I think she was really talking about screens. And when kids are young, I think if you say, listen, we just don't have technology in bedrooms. [00:16:59] Nicky Jackson: Bedrooms are for [00:17:00] sleeping and playing and studying or whatever. It makes it so that it's probably more likely that they'll be using technology. Around you in public spaces. So when they get to be like 16, 17, 18, and maybe you don't want them like sexting with their girlfriend or boyfriend, you're not then having the conversation about like, Hey, we don't trust you. [00:17:18] Nicky Jackson: And we don't want you in your bedroom with your phone. It's no, we've had this rule forever in our house. screens are just not for bedrooms. You can go to the couch and go to the living room. You can have your own privacy, but we just don't allow it in bedrooms. And so who knows, I mean, this might sound so outdated in a year or two, but we do follow that rule. [00:17:36] Nicky Jackson: I have found it to be helpful. And I like being able to kind of keep eyes on what they're doing, even when they're using their own devices. I also don't think that's like, You know, everybody has to do that. Like whatever works for, for you and your house is the right answer. [00:17:50] Barbara Mighdoll: I think that's a great strategy. [00:17:52] Barbara Mighdoll: Again, a couple of things that you just mentioned around kind of like public versus private spaces. Right. I think. At a [00:18:00] very young age, like my son who is almost four, I feel like private versus public space is like a concept that I could easily start integrating into our daily conversations that he could start grasping on the topic of kind of like healthy habits for tech. [00:18:14] Barbara Mighdoll: How have you thought about changing your own habits with technology in front of your kids to kind of lead by example? [00:18:21] Nicky Jackson: Yeah, it's not great. I'll tell you. I definitely have my phone in my room. So in terms of healthy habits. I try, and my kids were here right now, they'd be like, and she fails. I really try not to be on my phone texting around my kids or do, like, just kind of that, that space where your head is just somewhere else and you're on your phone and your kids are around, but you're like, I gotta send this email. [00:18:45] Nicky Jackson: I gotta. Make this grocery list or whatever it is. We all know when we get in that space. I try not to have that happen. If I'm like, listen, I need to take this call or I need to talk to your friend's mom or I'll say, listen, give me a second. I [00:19:00] am on my phone. I'm sending a message to Papa, their dad about the weekend. [00:19:05] Nicky Jackson: I try to give them context for what I'm doing so they don't think I'm just like scrolling Instagram when I'm around them. So that's one thing in terms of kids. I wish that I had the discipline to just not have my phone in my bedroom and only sleep there and whatever. I don't. And I kind of wake up in the morning and I'll check my work email really quickly. [00:19:23] Nicky Jackson: And it's kind of, I, I check in or like I'll do Wordle before I go to bed. I mean, I'm just, I, as parents, it's like our kids are eating like, organic great food and we're eating like Chinese takeout out of like containers cold after they go to bed. Like it's kind of that way for me in technology, but I try to make it so that my use of technology doesn't impact them and I fail, but I do try and I try to Be really mindful of it because technology, I mean, I am super pro tech. [00:19:53] Nicky Jackson: Like I work in tech. I love technology. I love innovation. I think about all the ways it's made my life so easier. It's [00:20:00] also really exhausting for us. Part of the reason that we haven't given them social media or smartphones is. They have their whole lives to kind of feel tired and on and like, people want their attention. [00:20:09] Nicky Jackson: And I'm like, Oh, just put it off. Cause once it's there, like everybody wants your attention. So true. It's so [00:20:15] Barbara Mighdoll: true. I think like to your point though, right? Like technology for us expands. A much wider range of uses than what it does for our kids. And on that topic, I'd love to pivot the conversation a little bit away from your job, but more of the behind the scenes on how you've built this village, whether that's with people or technology to have this strong support system around you. [00:20:40] Nicky Jackson: Yeah, so when we had kids, my husband and I were both from the East Coast and we were living in the Bay Area in California away from our families who are really supportive but just don't live with us and we knew we were going to be raising kids. without a lot of family around. And we both [00:21:00] worked and we didn't see that changing. [00:21:03] Nicky Jackson: We hired a nanny when I was going back to work with my first son and we were super grateful for her. Over time, she became like part of our family. Like calling her a nanny is, feels like a misnomer because she's like a second mother to my kids. She, It's just extremely loving. She's like a family member and she's been with us now for 14 years, like well beyond the age that my kids need. [00:21:27] Nicky Jackson: A quote unquote nanny in their lives, but we can't imagine our lives without her. We don't have family living nearby. And now her role has transitioned into helping with grocery shopping and a lot of the stuff that. As parents, we're doing after hours or in our spare time or on the weekend. So I need to start by saying that is privileged. [00:21:47] Nicky Jackson: That's just not possible for everybody. I am super grateful for her. And I'm super grateful that we are able to do that. I always say to any mom, whatever form the help comes in, get help for yourself. It [00:22:00] could be your neighbor, your mom, a family member. I have with other moms been like, anytime that you and your husband want to go out to dinner, I will come and sit there and go out to dinner and then we can exchange the favor, whatever form help takes, get help for yourself. [00:22:15] Nicky Jackson: If you can get any time, try. And then more on the organizational and technology side, we are a family that lives in two houses and their dad lives about 15 minutes away from me. We use Google calendar, everything, like every event that I have that, you know, Even if we don't know whose day it is or what's going on, everything goes on a shared calendar so that we have visibility. [00:22:40] Nicky Jackson: All travel goes on that calendar. And that's really helpful. And then we have a joint text thread with our nanny and their dad and me. And we are on that several times a day. Again, I think for a lot of divorced people, some people don't have that relationship with their spouse or they're not able to. I grew up, my dad passed [00:23:00] away when I was young. [00:23:00] Nicky Jackson: My mom was a full on single mom. Every Parent situation is different. There isn't one right way to do this. You're not a bad parent if co-parenting amicably isn't a possibility for you. But this is how we have kind of addressed it, given our situation. [00:23:18] Barbara Mighdoll: I think what's interesting right, is that, you know, he does live within 15 minutes of you, and so it sounds like you guys have a really great working relationship and sharing a lot of the responsibilities of your kids, right? [00:23:30] Barbara Mighdoll: And so one of the. You could call benefits of that, right? Is that maybe you end up not having the kids for a certain period of time, which maybe allows you to do some other things, whether that's like pulling your extra weight in the household because you don't have that partner or doing some things for yourself. [00:23:46] Barbara Mighdoll: I'm curious, what have you been able to do with some of that extra time, whether that is for yourself or for the house? [00:23:53] Nicky Jackson: It's funny. I don't know. I feel like we're all like buckets, whatever space is there. We just keep filling up with stuff. So [00:24:00] our kids. Again, this is particular to us. This would not be right for everybody. [00:24:04] Nicky Jackson: They do two days with him, two days with me. Cause they kind of miss each one of us. If it goes longer than that, I expect as they get older, they will love more time away from me or more time away from him, but that's where we are now. So I don't necessarily have them with me every day, but we're really flexible about if one of them needs to go to a soccer game and one of them has another lesson, like. [00:24:26] Nicky Jackson: Just because it's not my day like we still are dividing and taking that so you're still parenting even on your days off But my life has changed in the sense that like at night I'm not doing like that bedtime routine, right? like I might come home from work and I'd love to tell you that I was like getting a cocktail with a girlfriend half the time. [00:24:44] Nicky Jackson: I'm so tired It's like I, I get home from work, I kind of make basic dinner, which could be like a bowl of cereal. And I am like listening to an audio book or just trying to get extra sleep. I wish I could tell you [00:25:00] something exciting was going on and it's not usually, but I do think that what I get is a little bit more space in my head. [00:25:07] Nicky Jackson: To think about things, even if you're going to bed early and you're not doing anything exciting, I'm sorry, that is not possible for most moms. Most moms are working, whether they work full time, part time or they're what we call the stay at home mom, which I refer to as the works out of the home because stay at home moms have the hardest jobs. [00:25:24] Nicky Jackson: I don't know any mom whose brain isn't going right up until the moment they fall asleep. It is nice to have a brain break. But on the flip side, I think the hard part about divorce or separation is that You don't have your partner there with you all the time. That kind of sense of like, Hey, we're in this together at all times is different. [00:25:42] Nicky Jackson: It changes. I'm super grateful that my co parent. It does, he's like a team. I do feel like we're like a team and we're on the same team, but it's not constant and it's different. So there are benefits where I do get more of a, that space to just think or read a book. Like I couldn't even imagine having read a book when I was [00:26:00] raising little ones. [00:26:01] Nicky Jackson: But then I think there's more kind of in your head because you're running your house by yourself and you're thinking through stuff by yourself. So it's a little bit of a, I mean, I say mixed bag, it's, it's obviously much more than that, but it's 50, 50. [00:26:15] Barbara Mighdoll: Well, yeah, of course, because you're having to flex up on a lot of things that possibly like would have been shared responsibilities. [00:26:21] Barbara Mighdoll: I mean, immediately my mind goes to, oh my gosh, taxes and like financial planning. That's usually a team sport in a lot of homes. Yeah. [00:26:28] Nicky Jackson: Or like little things. I mean, this is broken or that is broken. That would be a moment when I would look at my husband and be like, okay, that's all you. And now it's, oh, I see the thing break and I'm like, oh God, I'm gonna have to like find someone to fix this. [00:26:40] Nicky Jackson: That's her. Okay. [00:26:41] Barbara Mighdoll: Okay. Yeah. So to your point, like the mental load, like it's maybe even greater, right? Cause like everything is on you to think about. You mentioned that your kids schedules are super hectic. Like they, they have multiple activities and just like the coordination of that. And I'm curious, given the stage of life that you're [00:27:00] in with your kids being so active, is there anything you would have done differently when they were younger, knowing how busy and hectic, like their schedules and your schedule is now? [00:27:12] Nicky Jackson: I think it's hard. No, which doesn't mean I did it perfectly. I just can't tell you how I would change it. I am a big believer in kids not being over scheduled. I really believe they need the time to go outside and play with leaves or like whatever it is that kids are doing outside or like just kick a ball with friends or whatever. [00:27:32] Nicky Jackson: When they were young, I loved having them in classes because it felt structured and it felt like, okay, this is a thing we're going to do before your nap and then we'll come home and then you'll have a nap. And it just helped me kind of plan my day. As they get older, my younger son's soccer schedule, just, he's only plays for one team. [00:27:50] Nicky Jackson: They have three practices a week and a game on the weekend. So there's not much I can do about that. He loves it. His dad is like super involved and a great cheerleader for him. And he just gets a lot [00:28:00] of it. personal enjoyment and fulfillment from that. So it's not doing much about that. But then outside of that on the weekends, we're not really doing a lot of other stuff. [00:28:09] Nicky Jackson: I don't want them just scheduled all the time. So no, I don't think there are things that we would necessarily do differently. Really do think kids at all ages, though, need to not feel like they're working. So they just need some downtime. And as a family, yeah, there are birthday parties on Sundays, and sometimes you never want your kid to miss out, and generally we've gotten the kids there, but there are times, especially when they were little, they were just like, We're not, we're just, we're not going to make that birthday party. [00:28:39] Nicky Jackson: And we just need the time at home as a family or we're exhausted and we can't handle one more activity. And I think that's fine. Your kid's not going to be socially ostracized if they miss one party at the pump it up. [00:28:52] Barbara Mighdoll: Definitely. I do want to really quickly just chat about your love for books because I don't know if it's just my. [00:28:59] Barbara Mighdoll: social [00:29:00] circle of friends, but I feel like there's been like this big resurgence of just people reading and like, there's like book talk and all of these different things where people are finding new books. And so just wanted to play a quick, like rapid fire of some of your favorite books. So do you have a favorite kind of self help or career advancement book that you recommend? [00:29:21] Nicky Jackson: No. And here's why I wish I could be this inspirational person. That's yes. Read X because it'll, I mentioned before, reading is like, For other people, like the gym, or yoga, or your religious institution of choice, for me, when I read, I want my head on anything except responsibilities and work. I am not trying to make myself a better person. [00:29:40] Nicky Jackson: I am trying to get lost in a story. So, that's not true for everybody. Some people love you know, books like that. I don't. I just like to read for pure escapism. Even if it's nonfiction, it could be about something super, I don't know, not very relaxing, but it's [00:30:00] still an escape for me. So I don't typically read books about self help. [00:30:04] Nicky Jackson: I don't even really read books about like Silicon Valley or anything. I'm just like, no, I want to read like something totally different. I love my job and I love where I live, but you know, I, I want to read about something totally different. So. [00:30:15] Barbara Mighdoll: So it's here and upon us. Give us. [00:30:21] Nicky Jackson: Oh my gosh, there are so many good ones. Okay. So like just delicious beetreats, just like getting into a warm bath. There is this book called Eligible by Curtis Sittenfeld, which is a modern day retelling of Pride and Prejudice, but it takes place, I believe in like Cincinnati, it's either Cleveland or Cincinnati, which is just like about. [00:30:40] Nicky Jackson: The last kind of place that you would think about when you think about like Jane Austen or whatever, but it's just, it's so delicious and like fun to read. I loved that book. I like reading mysteries. So mysteries are always like kind of fun for me. But then in terms of these aren't really beach reads, but, but reads where you just will get so into [00:31:00] it and just love the book. [00:31:01] Nicky Jackson: I just read Rebecca McKay, the great believers, which is. It's about the AIDS epidemic in San Francisco in the 80s and 90s, like the last thing that you would think you want to pick up. It's such a good book. And it's sad and touching, but not depressing. It was just so good. On the topic [00:31:17] Barbara Mighdoll: of time by yourself, you've shared with me offline that you've really put some thought into navigating work travel. [00:31:28] Barbara Mighdoll: With kids, and I'd love to explore some of the systems and strategies that you've put in place that have worked for you to really incorporate travel into your life and your career while managing your kids. Like you said, your kids have crazy schedules. You have a lot of things at home that you're taking care of. [00:31:46] Barbara Mighdoll: Obviously you have to prep for work itself. What does trip prep look like? [00:31:51] Nicky Jackson: Yeah. And it's changed over time. Um, let me start by saying that Work travel, people feel differently about it. Some [00:32:00] people are like, I dread it. I really hate being away from home. Some women are like, it's brain space away from home. [00:32:05] Nicky Jackson: And I really like to be on the plane and recharge. So everybody's different. What I say to the women that work for me, um, or, or people that I know is, ironically, it's easier to travel for work when your kids are really little, like when they're babies or toddlers, it's much harder on you at that point, because it's like, your heart is like, Leaving you when the plane takes off, but if they're well looked after and loved and cared for, it's like you leave and they'll be like, Oh, kiss. [00:32:33] Nicky Jackson: And then you come back and they're like, Oh, you're back. Hi. And they don't have as much of a sense of time passing. That's just not really going on for a toddler. So I always tell people like, don't feel guilty about traveling when your kids are. really little. It may be hard for you and that's understandable, but don't feel like a bad person. [00:32:51] Nicky Jackson: As they get older, they're like, well, why do you work? And not everyone works. Why do you travel? And not everyone travels. And we talk about that and, um, what [00:33:00] matters to me and why I think it's important. But I actually think it's a little harder to travel when they're older. And cause you're maybe missing things too, that you'd want to be there for. [00:33:09] Nicky Jackson: But the prep for the travel when they were little was really just making sure in our case that my partner was like, set up, do you have all the information? So immediately, like he always had the flights, the hotel knew everything was. then if there, if we needed any extra help, like at night, I mean, there was a period of time when we had two under two and they were both kind of little babies. [00:33:31] Nicky Jackson: And if you need, you Help at night or in the late afternoon. Let's make sure that's set up, but other than that was mostly, that was it. As they've gotten older, we're much more coordinated on if there are meetings that we need to call into, you might have to talk to a therapist, or you might have to talk to someone from school, or you might have to do a half hour and we're always comparing schedules if I'm going to be in. [00:33:54] Nicky Jackson: Vietnam, what time of day is that going to be for me? But I have it cleared on the calendar and I know that I can get [00:34:00] to a quiet room to do that call. So I still do parent calls even when I'm traveling, if I have to make time to talk to school or whatever, I will do that. When my kids were in the middle age. [00:34:11] Nicky Jackson: I would often film video, little videos from them for them from wherever I was like, Oh, Hey, I'm in X place. And I'm thinking about you because I just saw like this chocolate that I know you would love and maybe I'll bring you a bar. And I would actually send videos rather than FaceTiming because. When we would FaceTime, they'd be like, when are you coming home? [00:34:32] Nicky Jackson: We miss you. And it was almost a little triggering for them and upsetting for me. Whereas if I sent the video, I got to check in, say, I love you. I'm thinking of you. And they would see it and it would maybe like make them happy, but it, we, it wouldn't necessarily draw out something that was really triggering now. [00:34:50] Nicky Jackson: If I'm traveling, we talk on the phone regularly and they're more used to it. We also had a pact that we would never be gone on a weekend. So [00:35:00] travel for us was like Monday to Friday, even if I had to be like in Australia, like I'll be on the ground there and you can use me and abuse me for 18 hours a day. [00:35:07] Nicky Jackson: I'll do whatever you need, but I have to be home on Friday afternoon for my kids. As I've gotten older, sometimes I will fly out on a Sunday or like even on a late Saturday night if I have to be someplace where there's like a two day time getting to Asia or Australia because they're able to understand it and their dad's able to manage that. [00:35:25] Nicky Jackson: But that was our deal. Weekends were kind of like sacred family time and it was really important to be home on the weekend. [00:35:33] Barbara Mighdoll: Yeah, you have those clear boundaries. So you know what you need to get done Monday through through Friday, like you said, but then you still have that family time that the kids know is coming and is predictable and consistent. [00:35:46] Barbara Mighdoll: I love the idea behind the videos. We just did that actually for one of our most recent trips where we had left the kids for several days and we recorded like good morning videos every day and. My [00:36:00] son loved it so much. He started recording his own and sending it back to us. So it became like this little ritual. [00:36:05] Barbara Mighdoll: And I think for sure, we'll keep that up for our next trip. So many of our podcast guests do have kids that are under age five or six. And from the seat of someone with kids who are a bit older, I'd love to talk about. some more types of risk taking in your career. You mentioned take the work travel when they're younger, but looking back, you've built this really full career, really impressive roles. [00:36:33] Barbara Mighdoll: Is there anything from taking a job or raising your hand for certain projects, like that you think you would have done differently earlier on in your career or I think there's like this concept of people, once they have kids, right? They kind of go through this wave of, do I really lean into my career right now? [00:36:55] Barbara Mighdoll: Do I lean out? And I'm sort of curious if you have this framework or [00:37:00] blueprint on how you would coach somebody who does have younger kids on how to treat the stages in their career. [00:37:06] Nicky Jackson: Yeah, I can tell you how I thought about it and I kind of thought about it even before I had kids, but I do think a big piece of it like is to state the obvious, like you have one life and so I think it really comes down to, I think there is a lot of pressure on women like stay in the workforce, you need to keep working or why are you working? [00:37:28] Nicky Jackson: You should be home or you should be working part time or whatever. I think every single woman I know has it equally challenging. I do think a big piece of it is you have one life. What will make you genuinely happy? And part of that is, is privilege because not everyone can make that decision, right? They have to think about some people have to work and they're really, there are real constraints around work and life. [00:37:53] Nicky Jackson: But if you are able to make a choice, what is going to make you happy and live your life for yourself and not because you [00:38:00] think that if you take time off, that doesn't mean you're driven. Even if you decide to. Stay in the workforce. It's somehow you don't love your kids. Like you're human. And also let's just be honest that like men don't have to navigate many of these kind of weird binaries at all. [00:38:17] Nicky Jackson: Or if they do, um, I think it's in a different way. So I'm very into no guilt. Like, no shame, like, you know, live your life for yourself. I am the kind of person, the way I've always approached my career was while I'm in my career, I don't want to have regrets about opportunities I could have taken that I decided not to for whatever reason. [00:38:39] Nicky Jackson: So for example, really early in my career at Google, I really wanted to go and open this office and it was Google's first office in India. I really wanted to be put on that assignment. And, uh, But I was really young. I was like, I don't know, 22 or 23. I was like, there's no way they're going to send me. But I was like, if I don't at least put my hand [00:39:00] up and just say, I really would like to do this, I think I can do it. [00:39:03] Nicky Jackson: If they don't know, I think I will regret the fact that they didn't know. If they choose not to send me, fine. I did everything I could. And so, um, In that case, like I put my hand up and they sent me and that ended up being like a career defining experience for me. And I think that carries over to now where if there is something I really want to do, or I feel like is really important, I don't want to have regrets about not doing it. [00:39:27] Nicky Jackson: On the flip side, I have had moments in my career where, I think I shared with you offline, one of our children was having some challenges when he was about two and they didn't know what was going on. He needed a bunch of testing. He needed to meet with doctors. I, there was no doubt in my mind that I was not going to be able to. [00:39:50] Nicky Jackson: Be the kind of advocate that he needed me to be following up with doctors, getting him into clinics, getting him to therapies, everything that he needed if I [00:40:00] wasn't home. And there was just no doubt. I was like, I don't know what this means for my career, but it doesn't actually matter right now because and I took and I was at what was then Facebook, which is now meta and. [00:40:11] Nicky Jackson: They said, take the time that you need. I took nine months off to care for him. We got him all set up as much for success as we could. And we felt like he was in a really good place. And then I went back to work. I think the demands change over time, but it's like one don't not raise your hand for things because you're a mom, because it's really important to just, I think, not have those regrets. [00:40:33] Nicky Jackson: If there's something that you absolutely know that you can't do because it directly comes out of your family time or a boundary that you have, or you need to care for somebody or whatever, don't have guilt or shame. That's also what you need to do. And you probably would regret it the other way. So it's really hard. [00:40:49] Nicky Jackson: It's really hard to live authentically when there's all this kind of like cultural guilt on us. But I do think it's like you have one life. So try to take advantage of the opportunities you [00:41:00] get and, and also, you know, Obviously any of us I think would show up for our kids. I mean I dropped my career if I had to for my kids in a second. [00:41:08] Nicky Jackson: I'm glad that I don't have to because I get a lot from it. [00:41:12] Barbara Mighdoll: Such great advice and such a good outlook and framing to have on any type of career decision for sure. I would love to wrap up with, with my favorite question, which is what is your professional superpower and how have you seen it show up in your personal life? [00:41:29] Nicky Jackson: Oh gosh, I don't know if it's a superpower, but it's something I care deeply about. I really care about the people that I work with and I really believe in trying to be as good of a manager as I can be. And so I think everybody, whether it's our kids, it's employees and to different extents, but they really want to be seen. [00:41:51] Nicky Jackson: They want to be understood. They want opportunities to grow. They want to feel like they are acknowledged for the good work that they do. [00:42:00] I try wherever I can. Again, I don't know if it's a superpower, but I try to really see those things about people and acknowledge them, try to give them a platform. I feel really strongly about helping people grow cause I've had like really great people in my life who've helped me grow. [00:42:14] Nicky Jackson: So I feel really strongly about that. And then I think. That same sense of caring probably is part of my personal life, too, where I believe that, that children want to be seen for who they are, meeting them, trying to meet them where they are, accepting them who they are, trying not to. Make them feel bad for what they want to eat or what they want to watch or they want to be on a phone. [00:42:39] Nicky Jackson: No guilt, no shame, but at the same token, really strong discipline, a sense that we are still in charge. And what I find is that when you deeply care about people and you make them feel cared for, you are actually able to have the hard conversations, both with employees or with family, which is because we have this track record of. [00:42:57] Nicky Jackson: Me caring about you as a person and about your [00:43:00] growth. I also need to be the one to tell you that this isn't going well. Or I think we need to change tracks here. Or I, I don't see this as successful, much easier to have those conversations when people feel like you're actually in their corner. And I think that goes for kids to listen. [00:43:17] Nicky Jackson: I normally say yes. When you ask me if you can watch or eat or do this thing, because I believe in moderation and balance. So when I say no, here's why I'm saying no. It's not just because I'm, like, exerting weird power over you, like, the whole, like, because I said so kind of thing. It's because I actually feel like, you can't watch that movie. [00:43:37] Nicky Jackson: I don't want you to watch that movie, and here's why. So yeah, I think it's trying to make people feel seen, and then the flip side of that is being able to. Be really honest and direct because you have that kind of open communication. [00:43:53] Barbara Mighdoll: That's such a great skill, but definitely is transferable both ways. I love it. [00:43:58] Barbara Mighdoll: Nikki, how can listeners connect [00:44:00] with you after this episode? [00:44:02] Nicky Jackson: So, I mean, I am on LinkedIn, which I know is not everyone uses LinkedIn, but I'm on LinkedIn. I'm a real supporter of other women, again, wherever they work, whether they part time, full time working from the home, what we often refer to as stay at home moms, LinkedIn through you or through this podcast. [00:44:19] Nicky Jackson: I'm also not very often on the socials, but I do respond. And yeah, I love to hear from people and. And hear about what they're doing that, that I could benefit from because God knows we're all just trying to keep it together. So [00:44:33] Barbara Mighdoll: that we are Nikki, thank you so much for being here. I loved our chat today. [00:44:37] Barbara Mighdoll: Thanks. [00:44:38] Thanks for listening to this episode of the new modern mom podcast. I hope you can use the story shared today to simplify the chaos of career and motherhood. If you like what you heard, don't forget to subscribe to this podcast. Give us a five star rating and leave a review. Please connect with me on LinkedIn and follow new modern mom on Instagram. [00:44:58] I know you're busy and I so [00:45:00] appreciate your support for my mission to help more moms find work life fulfillment. And I have good news. The playbook doesn't end here. To get bonus strategies, tools, and takeaways from this guest, sign up for my newsletter at NewModernMom. com backslash subscribe. I promise you'll be filing this under a must read.Author
